Just a question: Does 'accidents' include accidental shootings? My suspicion is that the Cheney quail-hunting episode would be classified as an 'accident' rather than as 'homicide' if his lawyer pal hadn't pulled through.
Yeesh. I'm the worst kinda-pro-gun advocate around.
You know, I'm not for banning all guns. Guns do have a purpose for hunting and home protection. But the weapons that I'm referring to are rifles and shotguns. I used to hunt and never came into a hunting situation where I needed an assault rifle. I never came into a situation where I needed an automatic handgun, either. I did learn to use an assault rifle and an automatic hand gun in the Marine Corps. They had uses there. But I also learned how to only fire at what I intend to kill, to only point the weapon at something that I intend to fire upon and I also learned how to hit what I aimed at, unlike many people with guns. It's one thing to have an assault rifle in a fire fight with multiple enemies. It's another thing to have an assault rifle to "hunt". One other question comes to mind. If only law abiding, background-checked citizens are able to obtain guns, then there is a disconnect in the ability of criminals to obtain them. If they are getting them then maybe some of those law abiding folks aren't so law abiding. And the argument that those weapons may have been stolen from a registered gun owner kind of defeats the argument for home protection and tells me that they weren't secured in a safe manner, which tells me that they could have been reached and used by a child. I support the right to keep and bear arms, but I also support the revokation of that right from folks who have questionable or criminal backgrounds. And I support a long waiting period. I can't imagine a situation where not being able to purchase a gun the same day would cause me to miss out on hunting or cause me to be threatened in my home while I wait for the proper paperwork to go through. These argument for looser gun control don't stand up to logic.
And another illogical argument. "Guns kill less than heart disease, cancer, stroke, etc..." So, by that way of thinking we should just forget about working on curing all diseases except heart disease until that's cured, then we can worry about the others? Do you see the flaw in this way of thinking? And I can't remember the last time I've heard of someone attacking a school with heart disease.
I'll refrain from mentioning the old adage of "the bigger the gun, the smaller the..."
The thing is, almost all of the causes up here are diseases. No one's gonna argue that guns kill more people than cancer. But diseases have to be cured not illegalized.
Guns have killed many many people lately. People are getting guns very easily and then using them on people. Just owning a gun actually INCREASES the likelihood that you will use it on someone.
All of my guns have been bought from gun shows. I have had to go through the background check for every single one. The so called "gun show loop hole" is that if my grandfather wants to pass on a rifle to me, I dont have to go through a background check for him to give it to me. That is a private transaction. If a person sells guns for a living, they must meet numerous federal requirements and keep insane amounts of records on every transaction. Private transactions between individuals like grandfather to me or my brother selling his gun to his neighbor do not require background checks because neither my grandfather nor my brother are selling guns for a living.
Oh and I noticed you left out the part about the estimated 2,000,000 defensive uses of firearms in the US each year... look that one up on google, you'll see what I'm talking about.
How are a private transaction with your grandfather and no background checks at gun shows related? Unless your grandfather gives you his gun at a gun show...?
It suppose what I'm interested in knowing is: can I go to a gun show, meet some guy there that I've never seen before, and have him sell me a semiautomatic weapon or an assault rifle without any kind of a background check?
Also, 2,000,000 defensive uses per year seems ludicrously high. In an average lifespan of 80 years, that would mean 160 million Americans (more than half) would use a gun for defensive purposes at least once in their lifetime. Some basic probability crunching with those statistics indicates that it would be highly unlikely for any 25-year-old to know fewer than 40 people who pulled a gun on a criminal. And yet I know thousands of people and none have ever had to defend themselves with a gun. I've spoken with quite a few law enforcement officers over the years, and many of them make it 50 years in the force without having to draw their weapon.
Not that I'm against guns (I see good points either way), but you really can't hope to bring people on-side by dregding up flawed statistics.
For those of you who think the 2nd ammendment is "outdated" and should be removed: What happens if we piss China off and they get a bunch of row boats? they could amass an army of about 200-300 MILLION people. How are we supposed to fight that?
With 200-300 MILLION ammerican citizens armed with their personal weapons, ala insurgency style...
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." - Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto (Japanese Navy)
And here's a thought: We once thought this country was "alcohol crazy" and decided to ban it. We called it "Prohibition". how well did that work out for us again?
Wow, you're even worse than Bush. He invaded two countries illegally with his bs of WMDs, mushroom clouds, and threat to the US. Now you want us to believe that we need to arm ourselves to the teeth in anticipation of "they could amass an army of about 200-300 MILLION people. How are we supposed to fight that?"
You need to slow down on your meds. They are seriously affecting your ability to think rationally. China has no plans to invade the US, no intelligence agency anywhere in the world has even hinted at that possibility, especially the row boat part. :) You are totally dilusional.
What next?? Will the evil doers of DC Comics suddenly appear in the US to take us over? How about the Lizard people from the star Sirius?? Are they planning an attack too?? That has just as much a chance to happen as 300 million Chinese in row boats crossing the Pacific Ocean to invade the US. I guess our satellites can't detect anyone crossing the Pacific Ocean in row boats, right??
Actually, Prohibition worked pretty well. The number of people who abstained from alcohol use went up. After Prohibition, we can now definitively state that most crime is committed while perpetrators are under the influence of alcohol.
As to your comment about Chinese people in rowboats, I think its logic (or lack thereof) stands on its own.
A lot of people here are making comments similar to: If you think guns kill people, and therefore we should get rid of guns, well then while we're at it, let's get rid of cars, airplanes, matches, gasoline, scissors and knives too because they also kill people. There is a major problem with all of these arguments- because all of those other items serve different main functions. Their main function is not to be used as a weapon. Guns on the other hand, serve basically one purpose, and that is to kill. This is why certain things, arguably not very dangerous on their own, such as Chinese stars, Numchucks, and butterfly knives, are banned in many places. In fact, if technology can perfect the taser, or a tranq dart, then the self defense argument for guns basically goes away too, and guns that kill would no longer be needed.
there is also a type of non-lethal defense weapon being developed which operates a lot like a gun, except it fires a clump of this weird powdery stuff that falls apart on impact. The good thing is that it won't pierce the skin and usually won't break bones, but it hit's hard enough to knock the wind out of a fully grown person. It usually won't cause any lasting damage (unless perhaps you fire it at someone's temple) but it has the potential to be a very effective means of defense. I heard that some policemen are ALREADY using this weapons to stop criminals without killing them
i doubt that "weird powdery stuff" would have much of an effect. if its only strong enough to knock the wind out of a normal person i don't think it would help against someone trying to attack you. i've been punched in the stomach before it was a really strong hit and it knocked the wind out of me, but i was still standing and managed to keep up the fight sustaining multiple blows like that. sometimes lethal force is the only option. plus if guns become illegal then your gonna have a real pissed of public who would die for their freedom to bear arms.
This is an Israeli experiment an is "alternate ammunition" for standard weapons. This allows a standard load out to include both lethal and less lethal capacities with a magazin switch rather than multiple weapons. No law enforcement is using it as it is not fuly developed.
Non lethal, by the by, is a feel good term. Anything "non lethal" still has a level of lethality. Sometimes it's luck of the draw, some times it's how it's used that makes the difference.
Ok no one has mentioned this I don't think and almost all of you are way off the point. Guns don't stop bullets from being fired at you but they DO allow you to protect yourself if feel you need to. You will NEVER get rid of guns. It's impossible. Even when they are outlawed the same people you are scared of (the lawless) will still have guns because THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID LAWS!
The Second Amendment IS AND WAS put into effect so that the people of this country could protect themselves and their rights from the tyrant King of England. How ironic we are still trying to protect ourselves from tyrant King George. If you think that we are not "protecting" ourselves from an oppressive government right now, lets look at a little history shall we?
Consider: In 1929 the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953 approximately 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were round up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, the mentally ill, Jehovah's Witnesses, and others, who were unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
That places total victims who lost their lives because of gun control at approximately 56 million in the last century. Since we should learn from the mistakes of history, the next time someone talks in favor of gun control find out which group of citizens they wish to have exterminated.
It has not been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed, a program costing the government more than $500 million dollars. The results Australia-wide: Homicides are up 3.2%, Assaults are up 8%, Armed robberies are up 44% in that countries state of Victoria, homicides with firearms are up 300%.
It's time to state it plainly: Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws only affect the law-abiding citizens. Take action before it s too late, write or call your delegation.
>>find out which group of citizens they wish to have exterminated.
i think in this gent's case, it's clearly those suffering from diseases of the brain as he continually whined about the mentally ill not being adequately registered with the fedgov
On the other hand, you are picking facts out of history that don't have a proven correlation to guns. Canada has banned household weapons with restrictive gun laws, and there haven't been any massacres there. Nor in New Zealand, Sweden, or England. Since you mentioned Australia, let me just say that you can't just compare two years of statistics because there are lots of variations in that data. If you want your stats to be solid, you need multiple year baselines compared to multiple years of data.
Finally!! Someone with insight finally sees the REAL REASON that the people of the United States are being encouraged to give up their right to own guns. We no longer have a Democracy; we have an Oligarcy. A Democracy is one where the supreme power is vested in the people and is exercised directly by them or their elected agents. Definition of Oligarchy: A form of government in which the power is exercised by or invested in a few; a state so governed; the ruling few or class collectively. ( College Edition New Webster's Dictionary of the English Language, page 1034) In other words, we are governed by a few thousand rich and powerful people who care nothing for us and are seeking to enslave us. They wish to disarm the American People so there can be no grass-roots uprising of the People once they wake up to reality. The 16th amendment of the U. S. Constitution is a good example of the Oligarchy at work. They wanted to tax the income of the American People. They did not get enough votes to pass it, so the Oligarchy lied to the American People and said they did get enough votes. They then rewrote the 16th amendment of the Constitution and taxed the people's income. When the truth became known, the lie was illegally sanctioned by a Supreme Court judge. Today people who refuse to pay income tax on their wages are jailed and their assets taken from them. This would not happen in a Democracy. Keep your guns. Our founding fathers knew you may have need of them. Don't give up your right to bear arms. Giving up your right to own them will never prevent crime and it could cost you your freedom. WAKE UP AMERICA!!!
So you think the world is like an old western. The bad guy stands in front of the hero and the hero is faster on the draw because the villain is twirling his mustache.
The idea is so darn cute. In your mind brave Virginia students dive over tables firing automatic pistols. Not hitting anyone in the cross fire. In your mind the woman sees the rapist coming down a long alley, swigging from a bottle of moon shine leering at her with his one remaining eye. Our heroine gasps, her breasts bulging against the sheer fabric of her t-shirt, but then smiles and crouches removing the gun from her thigh before throwing her head back and letting out an Amazonian war cry the terrified rapist falls to his knees and finds god. She's certainly not spiked/unconcious and it's definitely a stranger and not a drunken friend (According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 38% of victims were raped by a friend or acquaintance, 28% by "an intimate" and 7% by another relative). In your mind hundreds of robbers itch desperately to kill someone in their own house, oh how they would love that. They certainly aren't just trying to get a bit of money, nope oh no no no,they're there purely to kill someone, because these people obviously have sub human morals.
Your claim that gun control leads to genocide is impressively flawed. Seriously, it's like saying Hitler was a vegan so soya causes slaughter. Its an unlinked fact, The idea that a militia can stand against a modern army is just weird. Unless it can shoot down a B 52 I don't think a hand gun will stop the American army carpet bombing your ass. Coincidently, thats one of the most arguments I hear to support the second amendment. Do you really not trust your own county?
Final point. Where do the bad guys get their guns in the first place. My guess? Something to do with gun shops. Gun shops with bad locks and window displays.
Why wouldn't this guy be against guns, he believes in man made global warming, which this site constantly claims.
The second amendment wasn't put in place to allow everybody to hunt or target practice. The second amendment was put in place by people who have left their homeland because of an oppessive government.They set up our constitution the way that they did to keep the people in power over a potentially opressive government here.
I would think that would be obvious that we already have an oppressive government to somebody that is preaching that the government has their talons wrapped around the health industry the way that it does. That is just ONE of MANY tentacles of our government.
One fact that you may want to consider. There have been more Genocide going on in the world by their OWN government THAN ALL OTHER GROUPS COMBINED!
As far as gun control goes. If these FOOLS think that they can walk into a gun show and purchase a gun without a background check they too have been brainwashed by the media and I have some ocean front property to sell them in Arizona.
I am more afraid of driving to work on the highway. It's like playing Russian Roulette. There are plenty of Morons out there that have a 4000 pound weapon that threaten me every day. The only reason that I don't give them an attitude adjustment if my fear of them having a gun! They have already proved they have no respect for anybody's life by the way they drive. (I myself speed too, I'm talking about the reckless drivers that swerve in and out of traffic at a high rate of speed). I think we need to ban cars...they're dangerous.
It's NOT THE GUNS. IT'S THE LACK OF RESPECT FOR OTHER PEOPLE'S LIVES. Just think if every teacher in that Virginia college was REQUIRED to take a gun handling class (for you city dwellers) and was REQUIRED to have them on hand at all times during school hours. How far do you think that Moron would have made it then?
Remember, Sept,11th was caused by little box cutters and Airplanes. I think we need to ban knives and any metal that could be turned into a blade and of course ALL airplanes.
This site has some good health information but they are clueless on just about everything else.
Right. Because it's a no-brainer that the 0.0007 percent increase in a gas making up less than 0.12 percent of the atmosphere is obviously what fully dictates Earth's climate.
And I say 'bah' to all that other 60,000 years of established climate patterns, Medieval warming period, sunspot theory, water vapour theory, volcanic theory, temperature-rise-precedes-CO2-rise scientific gobbledygook.
Those nice corporations that are always trying to scare us into buying crud we don't need would never swindle us into buying shiny, new low-CO2 versions of everything we already have. And they would never set up a massive, totally useless, wealth transfer engine from poor to rich with 'carbon credits'. In fact, I think we should trust those nice corporations so much that we should just ignore all that icky science stuff, shouldn't we, dude?
I mean, it would take a genius to figure that stuff out.
By "OUR" fault I meant the fault of human actions. Humans thicken the atmosphere with greenhouse gasses. This traps more and more of the suns heat. This (duh) causes the temperature to rise. As the amounts of co2 we released rose, so did the temperature.
You obviously missed the controversy where Mr. Gore was berated by scientists for sliding the CO2 curve back in time so that it preceded the temperature curve.
The causal relationship (evident in the actual, undoctored graph) is that rising temperatures eventually cause CO2 release into the atmosphere, and is accounted-for by well-established geological processes. Mr. Gore has since contended that the heat-causes-CO2-release relationship doesn't discount the possibility of climate change being man-made, but it begs the question of why he doctored the graphs in the first place.
Some might say that cheating the truth is acceptable so long as it 'helps the environment', but cheating accomplishes just the opposite. Funding and research are pulled away from far more serious (and far less imaginary) environmental problems.
A case in point: recently in home province of Ontario, Canada, federal funding for heavy-metal scrubbers in the smokestacks of nickel plants was scrapped because the scrubbers didn't have any effect on CO2 production. Never mind that airborne heavy metal toxins have been reliably linked to dozens of serious respiratory ailments in thousands of people--we want our funding to go to slaying that phantom carbon dragon.
My point being that the 'it can't hurt anybody' mentality about cheating the facts to create global warming hysteria is itself dangerous.
There is a simple concept to it. The greenhouse effect. When you put CO2 into the atmosphere, it makes it better at trapping heat between itself and the earth's surface.
Basically, regardless of what Gore may have done, if we continue to pump CO2 into the air, the temperature will rise. Ice will melt (this has already started to happen) which will cause the sea level to rise.
Everything you know is wrong. Watch "The Great Global Warming Swindle" documentary that the BBC put out and educate your propaganda-addicted mind. The issue is not as simple as 'Greenhouse gasses cause warming" no matter how hard you put your hands over your ears and say "nyah nyah nyah I can't hear you scientists, global warming is man-made nyah nyah nyah".
While I don't disagree that we need to be less or non-dependant on oil and other fossil fuels, and need to get the heck out of the Middle East, creating an entire inustry out of a giant propagandist lie in order to convince people to do the right thing is ultimately just evil. Yes, I'm talking to you, Al Gore.
"I think we just did, and were right in doing so."
well yes you did just do so, and yes technically you DO have the right to say what you want about things. However you were, in fact, incorrect in saying that global warming has nothing to do with CO2. Cause' it does!
P.S.
"I'd say more but... you know... the claustrophobia."
In the end I suppose, all that REALLY matters is that we stop polluting. This is because even if you don't believe in global warming, pollution is still an obvious threat. We need to stop using fossil fuels.
Our Forefathers did give us the right to have arms that was done to protect us from the British and other foreign invaders, but now times have changed. And their is a big huge problem since most states do not submit to the national database
Actually, they gave us the right to have arms in order that we can protect ourselves - not only from foreign powers - but from our own government, should it devolve into tyranny.
Has anyone ever noticed that this strange compulsion about the importance of a population to be armed like Rambo is only found in a handful of countries? The Second Amendment to the US Constitution allows the bearing of arms in the context of having a "well regulated militia". There may just be a hitorical context to this that doesn't find application in the modern day.
So the Health Ranger is Anti-Gun? It figures. I had hopes that he understood the concepts behind true freedom. But once again I am disappointed by a "Leader" of a "Movement". Eventually the truth will out.
There's a reason our founding forefathers included the 'right to bear arms' in our Constitution...and that reason VERY important (and possibly critical to basic survival)! (ever hear of a tyrannical government that's oppressive? did you know that there are several empty but manned concentration camps in every state? http://www.apfn.org/apfn/camps.htm
There's also a reason that we're seeing a rash of people 'going postal'...virtually every one of them have been taking or are withdrawing from chemical 'psycho-pharmaceuticals' to 'heal' totally unnatural 'diseases' caused by the chemical poisons in our food sources, prescribed drugs & vaccines, water, and the air we breath
If you haven't yet familiarized yourself with the Power's That Be plan (United Nations & World Health Organization) to depopulate the planet and create a one-world government, then it's difficult to see the links between all of this. The more killings we see, the more likely we are to willingly give up our guns...and when that happens, how can fight or protect ourselves.
Be sure to check out the link above (and check out the homepage).
"Geez... guns are neither good or bad. They're an inanimate object. Having a fear of an inanimate object is irrational. Are people scared of a knife. Scared of the gas in the tank of your car? How about a baseball bat?"
exactly
» I like freedom the MAN tryin to tell me ride da bus, aint down wit dat. I like rollin down da'street. I don't care how much gas cost. They already took my guns,had 9mm AR 12 gauge pump next they commin for my Baseball bat. The Man gonna take my bat but it ok for the Man to sell my kid taint food and toys. What we really need is an over-bearing, control-happy Government directed inward at the people who are supposed to be the ones in control.
Sounds logical...I guess we should take away everyones cars, just in case a crazy person gets behind the wheel of one those. We should take away everyones matches and lighters too, fires could be started by crazy people. Close up the gas stations...they might need an accelerant.
Fact: In the US, approximately 30,000 people die each year as a result of having been shot. (I won't say "killed by a gun"--this is inaccurate. Guns have no independent will). 15,000 of those are people who have chosen a loaded gun as the tool to use to end their own lives. So roughly 15,000 people per year, who did not choose to die, die as a result of a gunshot. And every single one is splashed all over the front pages, with many picked up by the national media. Stats are from the Justice Dept.
Fact: In the US, depending on whose study you want to use, anywhere between 40,000 and 250,000 times per year, a gun is used in self-defense. The vast majority of the time, the gun is never fired. If these incidents are reported at all, it is usually only in local press where the incident occurred. Even the Brady Campaign will admit the 40,000 number is valid.
Do the math. Guns are used far more often in self-defense than to kill.
Oh, & by the way, the major purpose of the 2nd Amendment is to give the people the power to resist tyranny. Even with a modern military, this is possible. Armed Iraqi citizens have been resisting the world's most modern army for the past several years now.
One last thing: A criminal is defined as someone who does not follow the law. Most people who commit crimes with guns are in violation of multiple laws, including gun control laws. The ONLY way you will EVER really keep guns out of the hands of criminals is to repeal the laws of physics that enable gunpowder to go BANG! Have fun with that.
Two murders in my little town in the past 5 years. One was committed with a hammer (guy killed his wife) and one with a pair or scissors (police haven't figured out who did that yet). I'm stocking up on hammers and scissors before the ban takes effect!
As always, Mark Fiore is right on the money with this cartoon. Purchasing firearms is alarmingly easy here in the United States.
However, I was taken aback with his portrayal of Cho Seung-Hui. The mentally ill are just that - ill. They do not elect to hear voices in their head, nor do they do not voluntarily allow themselves to succumb to delusion. Schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, etc. are medical conditions no different than heart disease or cancer.
What Cho Seung-Hui was horrible, but we must refrain from ridiculing people with mental illness. Drawing the mentally ill with broken-flowerpots on their head does nothing to help alleviate the stigma of mental illness.
Society failed on so many levels here. Cho was not given the care and treatment he so desperately needed, but was allowed to entertain his 'God given' right to own a deadly weapon.
Comments
Number of deaths for leading
Number of deaths for leading causes of death
Funny, Guns don't appear on this list maybe we should make these Illegal. It' do as much good.
Heart disease: 652,486
Cancer: 553,888
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 150,074
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 121,987
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 112,012
Diabetes: 73,138
Alzheimer's disease: 65,965
Influenza/Pneumonia: 59,664
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 42,480
Septicemia: 33,373
Source: CDC Deaths: Final Data for 2004, Table C
Just a question: Does
Just a question: Does 'accidents' include accidental shootings? My suspicion is that the Cheney quail-hunting episode would be classified as an 'accident' rather than as 'homicide' if his lawyer pal hadn't pulled through.
Yeesh. I'm the worst kinda-pro-gun advocate around.
You just don't read far
You just don't read far enough. Homicides are at place 15 in the list...
You know, I'm not for
You know, I'm not for banning all guns. Guns do have a purpose for hunting and home protection. But the weapons that I'm referring to are rifles and shotguns. I used to hunt and never came into a hunting situation where I needed an assault rifle. I never came into a situation where I needed an automatic handgun, either. I did learn to use an assault rifle and an automatic hand gun in the Marine Corps. They had uses there. But I also learned how to only fire at what I intend to kill, to only point the weapon at something that I intend to fire upon and I also learned how to hit what I aimed at, unlike many people with guns. It's one thing to have an assault rifle in a fire fight with multiple enemies. It's another thing to have an assault rifle to "hunt". One other question comes to mind. If only law abiding, background-checked citizens are able to obtain guns, then there is a disconnect in the ability of criminals to obtain them. If they are getting them then maybe some of those law abiding folks aren't so law abiding. And the argument that those weapons may have been stolen from a registered gun owner kind of defeats the argument for home protection and tells me that they weren't secured in a safe manner, which tells me that they could have been reached and used by a child. I support the right to keep and bear arms, but I also support the revokation of that right from folks who have questionable or criminal backgrounds. And I support a long waiting period. I can't imagine a situation where not being able to purchase a gun the same day would cause me to miss out on hunting or cause me to be threatened in my home while I wait for the proper paperwork to go through. These argument for looser gun control don't stand up to logic.
And another illogical argument. "Guns kill less than heart disease, cancer, stroke, etc..." So, by that way of thinking we should just forget about working on curing all diseases except heart disease until that's cured, then we can worry about the others? Do you see the flaw in this way of thinking? And I can't remember the last time I've heard of someone attacking a school with heart disease.
I'll refrain from mentioning the old adage of "the bigger the gun, the smaller the..."
The thing is, almost all of
The thing is, almost all of the causes up here are diseases. No one's gonna argue that guns kill more people than cancer. But diseases have to be cured not illegalized.
Guns have killed many many people lately. People are getting guns very easily and then using them on people. Just owning a gun actually INCREASES the likelihood that you will use it on someone.
All of my guns have been
All of my guns have been bought from gun shows. I have had to go through the background check for every single one. The so called "gun show loop hole" is that if my grandfather wants to pass on a rifle to me, I dont have to go through a background check for him to give it to me. That is a private transaction. If a person sells guns for a living, they must meet numerous federal requirements and keep insane amounts of records on every transaction. Private transactions between individuals like grandfather to me or my brother selling his gun to his neighbor do not require background checks because neither my grandfather nor my brother are selling guns for a living.
Oh and I noticed you left out the part about the estimated 2,000,000 defensive uses of firearms in the US each year... look that one up on google, you'll see what I'm talking about.
How are a private
How are a private transaction with your grandfather and no background checks at gun shows related? Unless your grandfather gives you his gun at a gun show...?
It suppose what I'm interested in knowing is: can I go to a gun show, meet some guy there that I've never seen before, and have him sell me a semiautomatic weapon or an assault rifle without any kind of a background check?
Also, 2,000,000 defensive uses per year seems ludicrously high. In an average lifespan of 80 years, that would mean 160 million Americans (more than half) would use a gun for defensive purposes at least once in their lifetime. Some basic probability crunching with those statistics indicates that it would be highly unlikely for any 25-year-old to know fewer than 40 people who pulled a gun on a criminal. And yet I know thousands of people and none have ever had to defend themselves with a gun. I've spoken with quite a few law enforcement officers over the years, and many of them make it 50 years in the force without having to draw their weapon.
Not that I'm against guns (I see good points either way), but you really can't hope to bring people on-side by dregding up flawed statistics.
For those of you who think
For those of you who think the 2nd ammendment is "outdated" and should be removed: What happens if we piss China off and they get a bunch of row boats? they could amass an army of about 200-300 MILLION people. How are we supposed to fight that?
With 200-300 MILLION ammerican citizens armed with their personal weapons, ala insurgency style...
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." - Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto (Japanese Navy)
And here's a thought: We once thought this country was "alcohol crazy" and decided to ban it. We called it "Prohibition". how well did that work out for us again?
Wow, you're even worse than
Wow, you're even worse than Bush. He invaded two countries illegally with his bs of WMDs, mushroom clouds, and threat to the US. Now you want us to believe that we need to arm ourselves to the teeth in anticipation of "they could amass an army of about 200-300 MILLION people. How are we supposed to fight that?"
You need to slow down on your meds. They are seriously affecting your ability to think rationally. China has no plans to invade the US, no intelligence agency anywhere in the world has even hinted at that possibility, especially the row boat part. :) You are totally dilusional.
What next?? Will the evil doers of DC Comics suddenly appear in the US to take us over? How about the Lizard people from the star Sirius?? Are they planning an attack too?? That has just as much a chance to happen as 300 million Chinese in row boats crossing the Pacific Ocean to invade the US. I guess our satellites can't detect anyone crossing the Pacific Ocean in row boats, right??
Actually, Prohibition worked
Actually, Prohibition worked pretty well. The number of people who abstained from alcohol use went up. After Prohibition, we can now definitively state that most crime is committed while perpetrators are under the influence of alcohol.
As to your comment about Chinese people in rowboats, I think its logic (or lack thereof) stands on its own.
A lot of people here are
A lot of people here are making comments similar to: If you think guns kill people, and therefore we should get rid of guns, well then while we're at it, let's get rid of cars, airplanes, matches, gasoline, scissors and knives too because they also kill people. There is a major problem with all of these arguments- because all of those other items serve different main functions. Their main function is not to be used as a weapon. Guns on the other hand, serve basically one purpose, and that is to kill. This is why certain things, arguably not very dangerous on their own, such as Chinese stars, Numchucks, and butterfly knives, are banned in many places. In fact, if technology can perfect the taser, or a tranq dart, then the self defense argument for guns basically goes away too, and guns that kill would no longer be needed.
there is also a type of
there is also a type of non-lethal defense weapon being developed which operates a lot like a gun, except it fires a clump of this weird powdery stuff that falls apart on impact. The good thing is that it won't pierce the skin and usually won't break bones, but it hit's hard enough to knock the wind out of a fully grown person. It usually won't cause any lasting damage (unless perhaps you fire it at someone's temple) but it has the potential to be a very effective means of defense. I heard that some policemen are ALREADY using this weapons to stop criminals without killing them
i doubt that "weird powdery
i doubt that "weird powdery stuff" would have much of an effect. if its only strong enough to knock the wind out of a normal person i don't think it would help against someone trying to attack you. i've been punched in the stomach before it was a really strong hit and it knocked the wind out of me, but i was still standing and managed to keep up the fight sustaining multiple blows like that. sometimes lethal force is the only option. plus if guns become illegal then your gonna have a real pissed of public who would die for their freedom to bear arms.
This is an Israeli
This is an Israeli experiment an is "alternate ammunition" for standard weapons. This allows a standard load out to include both lethal and less lethal capacities with a magazin switch rather than multiple weapons. No law enforcement is using it as it is not fuly developed.
Non lethal, by the by, is a feel good term. Anything "non lethal" still has a level of lethality. Sometimes it's luck of the draw, some times it's how it's used that makes the difference.
Ok no one has mentioned this
Ok no one has mentioned this I don't think and almost all of you are way off the point. Guns don't stop bullets from being fired at you but they DO allow you to protect yourself if feel you need to. You will NEVER get rid of guns. It's impossible. Even when they are outlawed the same people you are scared of (the lawless) will still have guns because THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID LAWS!
The Second Amendment IS AND WAS put into effect so that the people of this country could protect themselves and their rights from the tyrant King of England. How ironic we are still trying to protect ourselves from tyrant King George. If you think that we are not "protecting" ourselves from an oppressive government right now, lets look at a little history shall we?
Consider: In 1929 the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953 approximately 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were round up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, the mentally ill, Jehovah's Witnesses, and others, who were unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
That places total victims who lost their lives because of gun control at approximately 56 million in the last century. Since we should learn from the mistakes of history, the next time someone talks in favor of gun control find out which group of citizens they wish to have exterminated.
It has not been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed, a program costing the government more than $500 million dollars. The results Australia-wide: Homicides are up 3.2%, Assaults are up 8%, Armed robberies are up 44% in that countries state of Victoria, homicides with firearms are up 300%.
It's time to state it plainly: Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws only affect the law-abiding citizens. Take action before it s too late, write or call your delegation.
>>find out which group of
>>find out which group of citizens they wish to have exterminated.
i think in this gent's case, it's clearly those suffering from diseases of the brain as he continually whined about the mentally ill not being adequately registered with the fedgov
On the other hand, you are
On the other hand, you are picking facts out of history that don't have a proven correlation to guns. Canada has banned household weapons with restrictive gun laws, and there haven't been any massacres there. Nor in New Zealand, Sweden, or England. Since you mentioned Australia, let me just say that you can't just compare two years of statistics because there are lots of variations in that data. If you want your stats to be solid, you need multiple year baselines compared to multiple years of data.
Finally!! Someone with
Finally!! Someone with insight finally sees the REAL REASON that the people of the United States are being encouraged to give up their right to own guns. We no longer have a Democracy; we have an Oligarcy. A Democracy is one where the supreme power is vested in the people and is exercised directly by them or their elected agents. Definition of Oligarchy: A form of government in which the power is exercised by or invested in a few; a state so governed; the ruling few or class collectively. ( College Edition New Webster's Dictionary of the English Language, page 1034) In other words, we are governed by a few thousand rich and powerful people who care nothing for us and are seeking to enslave us. They wish to disarm the American People so there can be no grass-roots uprising of the People once they wake up to reality. The 16th amendment of the U. S. Constitution is a good example of the Oligarchy at work. They wanted to tax the income of the American People. They did not get enough votes to pass it, so the Oligarchy lied to the American People and said they did get enough votes. They then rewrote the 16th amendment of the Constitution and taxed the people's income. When the truth became known, the lie was illegally sanctioned by a Supreme Court judge. Today people who refuse to pay income tax on their wages are jailed and their assets taken from them. This would not happen in a Democracy. Keep your guns. Our founding fathers knew you may have need of them. Don't give up your right to bear arms. Giving up your right to own them will never prevent crime and it could cost you your freedom. WAKE UP AMERICA!!!
So you think the world is
So you think the world is like an old western. The bad guy stands in front of the hero and the hero is faster on the draw because the villain is twirling his mustache.
The idea is so darn cute. In your mind brave Virginia students dive over tables firing automatic pistols. Not hitting anyone in the cross fire. In your mind the woman sees the rapist coming down a long alley, swigging from a bottle of moon shine leering at her with his one remaining eye. Our heroine gasps, her breasts bulging against the sheer fabric of her t-shirt, but then smiles and crouches removing the gun from her thigh before throwing her head back and letting out an Amazonian war cry the terrified rapist falls to his knees and finds god. She's certainly not spiked/unconcious and it's definitely a stranger and not a drunken friend (According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, 38% of victims were raped by a friend or acquaintance, 28% by "an intimate" and 7% by another relative). In your mind hundreds of robbers itch desperately to kill someone in their own house, oh how they would love that. They certainly aren't just trying to get a bit of money, nope oh no no no,they're there purely to kill someone, because these people obviously have sub human morals.
Your claim that gun control leads to genocide is impressively flawed. Seriously, it's like saying Hitler was a vegan so soya causes slaughter. Its an unlinked fact, The idea that a militia can stand against a modern army is just weird. Unless it can shoot down a B 52 I don't think a hand gun will stop the American army carpet bombing your ass. Coincidently, thats one of the most arguments I hear to support the second amendment. Do you really not trust your own county?
Final point. Where do the bad guys get their guns in the first place. My guess? Something to do with gun shops. Gun shops with bad locks and window displays.
Why wouldn't this guy be
Why wouldn't this guy be against guns, he believes in man made global warming, which this site constantly claims.
The second amendment wasn't put in place to allow everybody to hunt or target practice. The second amendment was put in place by people who have left their homeland because of an oppessive government.They set up our constitution the way that they did to keep the people in power over a potentially opressive government here.
I would think that would be obvious that we already have an oppressive government to somebody that is preaching that the government has their talons wrapped around the health industry the way that it does. That is just ONE of MANY tentacles of our government.
One fact that you may want to consider. There have been more Genocide going on in the world by their OWN government THAN ALL OTHER GROUPS COMBINED!
As far as gun control goes. If these FOOLS think that they can walk into a gun show and purchase a gun without a background check they too have been brainwashed by the media and I have some ocean front property to sell them in Arizona.
I am more afraid of driving to work on the highway. It's like playing Russian Roulette. There are plenty of Morons out there that have a 4000 pound weapon that threaten me every day. The only reason that I don't give them an attitude adjustment if my fear of them having a gun! They have already proved they have no respect for anybody's life by the way they drive. (I myself speed too, I'm talking about the reckless drivers that swerve in and out of traffic at a high rate of speed). I think we need to ban cars...they're dangerous.
It's NOT THE GUNS. IT'S THE LACK OF RESPECT FOR OTHER PEOPLE'S LIVES. Just think if every teacher in that Virginia college was REQUIRED to take a gun handling class (for you city dwellers) and was REQUIRED to have them on hand at all times during school hours. How far do you think that Moron would have made it then?
Remember, Sept,11th was caused by little box cutters and Airplanes. I think we need to ban knives and any metal that could be turned into a blade and of course ALL airplanes.
This site has some good health information but they are clueless on just about everything else.
"Why wouldn't this guy be
"Why wouldn't this guy be against guns, he believes in man made global warming, which this site constantly claims."
global warming IS man caused!!!!!
you should really try
you should really try reading both sides of the argument before you go throwing words around so recklessly.
dude. It doesn't take a
dude. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that global warming is our fault.
Right. Because it's a
Right. Because it's a no-brainer that the 0.0007 percent increase in a gas making up less than 0.12 percent of the atmosphere is obviously what fully dictates Earth's climate.
And I say 'bah' to all that other 60,000 years of established climate patterns, Medieval warming period, sunspot theory, water vapour theory, volcanic theory, temperature-rise-precedes-CO2-rise scientific gobbledygook.
Those nice corporations that are always trying to scare us into buying crud we don't need would never swindle us into buying shiny, new low-CO2 versions of everything we already have. And they would never set up a massive, totally useless, wealth transfer engine from poor to rich with 'carbon credits'. In fact, I think we should trust those nice corporations so much that we should just ignore all that icky science stuff, shouldn't we, dude?
I mean, it would take a genius to figure that stuff out.
By "OUR" fault I meant the
By "OUR" fault I meant the fault of human actions. Humans thicken the atmosphere with greenhouse gasses. This traps more and more of the suns heat. This (duh) causes the temperature to rise. As the amounts of co2 we released rose, so did the temperature.
You obviously missed the
You obviously missed the controversy where Mr. Gore was berated by scientists for sliding the CO2 curve back in time so that it preceded the temperature curve.
The causal relationship (evident in the actual, undoctored graph) is that rising temperatures eventually cause CO2 release into the atmosphere, and is accounted-for by well-established geological processes. Mr. Gore has since contended that the heat-causes-CO2-release relationship doesn't discount the possibility of climate change being man-made, but it begs the question of why he doctored the graphs in the first place.
Some might say that cheating the truth is acceptable so long as it 'helps the environment', but cheating accomplishes just the opposite. Funding and research are pulled away from far more serious (and far less imaginary) environmental problems.
A case in point: recently in home province of Ontario, Canada, federal funding for heavy-metal scrubbers in the smokestacks of nickel plants was scrapped because the scrubbers didn't have any effect on CO2 production. Never mind that airborne heavy metal toxins have been reliably linked to dozens of serious respiratory ailments in thousands of people--we want our funding to go to slaying that phantom carbon dragon.
My point being that the 'it can't hurt anybody' mentality about cheating the facts to create global warming hysteria is itself dangerous.
There is a simple concept to
There is a simple concept to it. The greenhouse effect. When you put CO2 into the atmosphere, it makes it better at trapping heat between itself and the earth's surface.
Basically, regardless of what Gore may have done, if we continue to pump CO2 into the air, the temperature will rise. Ice will melt (this has already started to happen) which will cause the sea level to rise.
It's pretty simple really.
Everything you know is
Everything you know is wrong. Watch "The Great Global Warming Swindle" documentary that the BBC put out and educate your propaganda-addicted mind. The issue is not as simple as 'Greenhouse gasses cause warming" no matter how hard you put your hands over your ears and say "nyah nyah nyah I can't hear you scientists, global warming is man-made nyah nyah nyah".
While I don't disagree that we need to be less or non-dependant on oil and other fossil fuels, and need to get the heck out of the Middle East, creating an entire inustry out of a giant propagandist lie in order to convince people to do the right thing is ultimately just evil. Yes, I'm talking to you, Al Gore.
If you think that global
If you think that global warming isn't our fault, then you REALLY shouldn't be pointing fingers at people for ignoring science.
I think we just did, and
I think we just did, and were right in doing so.
I'd say more but... you know... the claustrophobia.
"I think we just did, and
"I think we just did, and were right in doing so."
well yes you did just do so, and yes technically you DO have the right to say what you want about things. However you were, in fact, incorrect in saying that global warming has nothing to do with CO2. Cause' it does!
P.S.
"I'd say more but... you know... the claustrophobia."
I cracked up when i saw this part.
this one's just to get
this one's just to get thinner!
"I can't hear you
"I can't hear you scientists?"
What do you think the overwhelming majority of scientists are concluding about global warming? Turn off the AM radio and investigate it on your own.
In the end I suppose, all
In the end I suppose, all that REALLY matters is that we stop polluting. This is because even if you don't believe in global warming, pollution is still an obvious threat. We need to stop using fossil fuels.
how did global warming come
how did global warming come up?
Our Forefathers did give us
Our Forefathers did give us the right to have arms that was done to protect us from the British and other foreign invaders, but now times have changed. And their is a big huge problem since most states do not submit to the national database
Actually, they gave us the
Actually, they gave us the right to have arms in order that we can protect ourselves - not only from foreign powers - but from our own government, should it devolve into tyranny.
Has anyone ever noticed that
Has anyone ever noticed that this strange compulsion about the importance of a population to be armed like Rambo is only found in a handful of countries? The Second Amendment to the US Constitution allows the bearing of arms in the context of having a "well regulated militia". There may just be a hitorical context to this that doesn't find application in the modern day.
I call on all weapons
I call on all weapons manufacturers to face war crimes... who needs guns
So the Health Ranger is
So the Health Ranger is Anti-Gun? It figures. I had hopes that he understood the concepts behind true freedom. But once again I am disappointed by a "Leader" of a "Movement". Eventually the truth will out.
Me, too :-(. It's really
Me, too :-(. It's really difficult to recommend him to other people when I'm not sure whether or not this sort of drivel will be on the front page.
btw, if the university hadn't been a gun-free zone, that shooter would've been taken out after the first murder.
There's a reason our
There's a reason our founding forefathers included the 'right to bear arms' in our Constitution...and that reason VERY important (and possibly critical to basic survival)! (ever hear of a tyrannical government that's oppressive? did you know that there are several empty but manned concentration camps in every state?
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/camps.htm
There's also a reason that we're seeing a rash of people 'going postal'...virtually every one of them have been taking or are withdrawing from chemical 'psycho-pharmaceuticals' to 'heal' totally unnatural 'diseases' caused by the chemical poisons in our food sources, prescribed drugs & vaccines, water, and the air we breath
If you haven't yet familiarized yourself with the Power's That Be plan (United Nations & World Health Organization) to depopulate the planet and create a one-world government, then it's difficult to see the links between all of this. The more killings we see, the more likely we are to willingly give up our guns...and when that happens, how can fight or protect ourselves.
Be sure to check out the link above (and check out the homepage).
"Geez... guns are neither
"Geez... guns are neither good or bad. They're an inanimate object. Having a fear of an inanimate object is irrational. Are people scared of a knife. Scared of the gas in the tank of your car? How about a baseball bat?"
exactly
» I like freedom the MAN tryin to tell me ride da bus, aint down wit dat. I like rollin down da'street. I don't care how much gas cost. They already took my guns,had 9mm AR 12 gauge pump next they commin for my Baseball bat. The Man gonna take my bat but it ok for the Man to sell my kid taint food and toys. What we really need is an over-bearing, control-happy Government directed inward at the people who are supposed to be the ones in control.
Nice Trick ,Huh...
Sounds logical...I guess we
Sounds logical...I guess we should take away everyones cars, just in case a crazy person gets behind the wheel of one those. We should take away everyones matches and lighters too, fires could be started by crazy people. Close up the gas stations...they might need an accelerant.
you're completely missing
you're completely missing the point.
Please no more murder !!!
Please no more murder !!!
Please no more people
Please no more people hurting each other at all !!!
Fact: In the US,
Fact: In the US, approximately 30,000 people die each year as a result of having been shot. (I won't say "killed by a gun"--this is inaccurate. Guns have no independent will). 15,000 of those are people who have chosen a loaded gun as the tool to use to end their own lives. So roughly 15,000 people per year, who did not choose to die, die as a result of a gunshot. And every single one is splashed all over the front pages, with many picked up by the national media. Stats are from the Justice Dept.
Fact: In the US, depending on whose study you want to use, anywhere between 40,000 and 250,000 times per year, a gun is used in self-defense. The vast majority of the time, the gun is never fired. If these incidents are reported at all, it is usually only in local press where the incident occurred. Even the Brady Campaign will admit the 40,000 number is valid.
Do the math. Guns are used far more often in self-defense than to kill.
Oh, & by the way, the major purpose of the 2nd Amendment is to give the people the power to resist tyranny. Even with a modern military, this is possible. Armed Iraqi citizens have been resisting the world's most modern army for the past several years now.
One last thing: A criminal is defined as someone who does not follow the law. Most people who commit crimes with guns are in violation of multiple laws, including gun control laws. The ONLY way you will EVER really keep guns out of the hands of criminals is to repeal the laws of physics that enable gunpowder to go BANG! Have fun with that.
Two murders in my little
Two murders in my little town in the past 5 years. One was committed with a hammer (guy killed his wife) and one with a pair or scissors (police haven't figured out who did that yet). I'm stocking up on hammers and scissors before the ban takes effect!
As always, Mark Fiore is
As always, Mark Fiore is right on the money with this cartoon. Purchasing firearms is alarmingly easy here in the United States.
However, I was taken aback with his portrayal of Cho Seung-Hui. The mentally ill are just that - ill. They do not elect to hear voices in their head, nor do they do not voluntarily allow themselves to succumb to delusion. Schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, etc. are medical conditions no different than heart disease or cancer.
What Cho Seung-Hui was horrible, but we must refrain from ridiculing people with mental illness. Drawing the mentally ill with broken-flowerpots on their head does nothing to help alleviate the stigma of mental illness.
Society failed on so many levels here. Cho was not given the care and treatment he so desperately needed, but was allowed to entertain his 'God given' right to own a deadly weapon.
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